Director Martin Scorsese doesn’t seem to think Marvel movies are “cinema” whatever that means. You might have heard that Marvel fans were not happy with the diss on their favorite movies. Well, Scorsese has clarified what he meant.
The director doubles down on his belief that Marvel movies aren’t cinema and again makes the theme park comparison. He believes that Marvel movies have value and people can like them or not, but that they provide a different type of experience, and that experience doesn’t meet his definition of cinema.
Martin Scorsese Clarifies Controversial Comments About Marvel Movies
Art is subjective. Scorsese has a right to his opinion. Whether or not he dished this at a time that he was wanted more publicity for The Irishmen which isn’t getting a wide theatrical release (ironic, actually) is open to speculation.
I don’t agree that Marvel movies aren’t just as much “cinema” as any other movie. Seems a little bit like class snobbery when we talk about how one piece of art not being art because it doesn’t meet some set of conditions. Art is art, period.
Just my two cents. Scorsese is entitled to classify movies however he wants. I don’t see any difference cinematically between Goodfellas and Avengers, sorry, but if he does, there’s no point in beating the famous director down. Some critics are hypersensitive, too, just ask Queen’s Roger Taylor.
Honestly, I’m not as big a fan of the MCU right now either but it’s not for the same reasons as Scorsese, it is burnout on some of the characters. In my opinion, they’ve rebooted some of their characters too many times. Enough Spider-Man being rebooted, let’s get a character deeper in the comic books sort of like what DC did with Joker ⭐️⭐️⭐️½ . Plenty of other characters than the most popular ones getting trotted out time and again.
Movies, Movies, Movies 
More wood thrown to the fire. Coppola has joined that club with his: “[Marvel movies are] despicable.”
I need more popcorn.
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Great directors, but why the elitism? I don’t get it. Who cares what other people enjoy en masse, they are the ones paying the freight. Offending the paying customers never works
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There are interesting topics to discuss surrounding this issue, but I don’t take it seriously because it’s not even a discussion. It’s pure reactions. The media just throws up two or three remarks in search of clicks and the rest is just emotional responses from fans.
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If it shows up in the theater, it’s cinema. I guess that’s my take. Without an exhaustive interview with the parties involved, we’ll never know what they meant. Although I agree there is some clickbaiting in play, I would like to see a more in depth interview. Maybe we’ll get one … apparently there is a growing list of directors who are essentially agreeing on the subject. Saw the list at Cinemablend: https://www.cinemablend.com/news/2482437/6-directors-who-have-been-heavily-critical-of-superhero-movies
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Ooooh, I have to check that list. But essentially yeah, it would be good to know, for instance, how Scorsese defines cinema. I have a feeling that his definition is more abstract, rather than just the location or devices used to project a film.
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I’ve read the list. I think if they would go public, more major directors could be added to that list. The comic book fandom would never understand anyway. For them, their comic book movies are “masterpieces” and “high-art.”
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Art is subjective. Who are we or these directors to define what is “art”? I don’t mean that as any specific challenge , rather as a discussion point. I’ve seen art pieces that are literally trash glued together and that is not art to me personally, it’s garbage glued together … but who am I to tell others that glued garbage is not ‘art’? That is where I’m having the biggest problem here and I think that’s what Marvel fans are saying. Although, they probably aren’t being as diplomatic about it. It’s one thing for these directors to bind together and say “this is not art in my opinion” but the Marvel fans could also gather and the opposite. It just never ends.
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We’re all entitled to our opinions, true, but I believe cinema as an art form is not fully subjective as many would think. Thanks to the hard work of countless of people throughout decades (for cinema) and centuries (for art), cinema has well defined principles (art theory), analytical frameworks (film theory) and a body of evidence (thanks to multidisciplinary research) that serve as guidelines to our understanding of the medium. In other words, these tools help us remove some of the “subjectivity” and allow us to insert more “objectivity” into our analysis.
I think the claim “art is subjective” is the easy way out. There is more to say about cinema as art than just a subjective claim or a personal opinion.
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Going back to Scorsese and Coppola, I think the whole issue is that their wording requires long explanations, and they don’t have the time. For them, it was just a quick question from a reporter and they just gave their quick answer about it.
But I definitely think both of them have greater insights about cinema as art than a Marvel fan. And I have a strong feeling that many other respectable filmmakers would follow along, but what are you gonna do against 1 billion Marvel fans, their money, and their “art is subjective” shield?
It’s a fool’s game.
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Thank you, good points, good discussion (why can’t the two opposing camps do this?). The problem with any reporter interview is being quoted out of context. Perhaps this director group could bind together and come up with some sort of detailed guidelines for what is cinema to them? If they don’t want to take the time to explain fully their position, then it will come off to most people as elitist. Yes, there are some that will think, these people are gods of cinema, and agree without any detail. I’m not one of those people, unfortunately. I also think some of the Marvel movies have gone deeper than these directors are giving credit.
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Yeah, it requires a calm and reflective discussion away from the rushed-nature of news reporting. And just like that, Ken Loach has joined the club:
https://news.sky.com/story/ken-loach-marvel-superhero-films-boring-and-nothing-to-do-with-art-of-cinema-11841486
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Seems like a pile-on each way. I don’t like how these directors are doing it, “…and by the way I have ___ coming out.” It hurts their point of view — even if it’s a compelling argument — when they are using their inflammatory comments and then promoting their newest movie.
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I do want to point something out.
If you play the video, notice that the background has been arranged and you can clearly see the film’s title on the wall. That means that the main context was always the promotion of his film. The superhero remarks are just side-comments (probably pushed by the interviewer).
He’s not diminishing superhero films and then promoting his film. It’s the other way round.
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Of course interviewers are trapping him in this commentary and he should have taken the high road. It is all about perception. Look at the article, 75% of it is promo for his movie (which honestly I knew nothing about until today, so maybe that means it is working). Also the article is comparing his movie to being the opposite of superhero movies, so it’s pumping up the conflict. These guys need to be smarter about how they do this. Wrong time to say anything about superhero movies. I would have said, “No comment.”
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Some (or most) members of the press are experts at twisting words and situations. You may do an interview that you think went one way, but when they write the story it comes up another way. I think you’re right, if the interview is about your film, you should avoid going off topic.
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And someone just pointed out to me some truly incendiary comments from David Cronenberg made in 2012 (The Hollywood Reporter). Also John McTiernan in 2016 (International Business Times). Suffice to say that they don’t think superhero movies are good for cinema as an art-form.
The list keeps growing.
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I just wrote another post on the subject that will be up later today. In the process of gathering other blogs and articles on the subject (feel free to share here any you think should be included) so that my opinion isn’t the only one featured. I doubt many others will care, but at least I’ll do my part in trying to have a civil discussion on the topic that answers the question from both sides and isn’t so polarizing either way.
I don’t really think the issue is, other than the business side of all of this, which is my main concern, honestly. Selfishly, I also admit. I love seeing all types of movies at the theater in all different genres, directors, actors, etc. I try not to hold any biases that prevent me from giving everything a chance. Unfortunately, I realize that puts me in an extremely tiny minority.
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Just for the record, I’ve seen all MCU movies (in theatres). The ones I enjoyed the most are Winter Soldier, Guardians of the Galaxy (both), Black Panther and Infinity War.
Just saying 🙂
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Heck, your superhero record is better than mine. I haven’t seen Avengers: Endgame. I haven’t even seen Infinity War and that has been on Netflix. Started watching a couple times, got distracted and wanted to come back. Same with Black Panther (this distraction never happens at the theater — another reason I enjoy the theater for movies).
I saw all the Iron Man and Hulk movies in the theater. Those are among my two favorite comic book characters. Saw some of the X-Men movies. Loved the first two actually. Now, as for DC, I really enjoyed Wonder Woman and am looking forward to Wonder Woman 1984 (Gal Gadot +++). I’m clearly a fan of some superhero movies and characters. I was surprised that i liked Wonder Woman, actually, because I loved the TV Series and thought the movie would disappoint, but it turned me around.
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